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Corvette totaled from one inch of damage

I work for the company that make the "pansy" aluminum for the Ford trucks. What GM doesn't say and most idiotic comments about beer can aluminum is that the aluminum is actually stronger than the steel. Yes if the thickness were the same, the steel would be stronger but the gauge of the aluminum used in the bed is much thicker than the steel in the GM bed. Tests using actual data show the aluminum to be more dent resistant than the steel. And it's still lighter. And won't rust thru. Ford didn't just wake up one day and decide to make an all aluminum body. They have been working with us since the 90's and made several all aluminum Mercury Sables for real world testing. They have been researching bonding, welding, crumple zones, etc. for years. GM and all the others for that matter are so far behind the cutting edge they will be years catching up, but yes, others are using aluminum too in more and more body panels. Most of your social media memes and "fake news" are just that. Not based on facts. Ford does use steel in the firewall, that is one area aluminum couldn't match or beat steel (fire resistance). GM is stuck in the past, they use push rod engines, yes they work and work well and they still use steel. High strength steel. Which by the way is just as expensive as aluminum and cant be repaired (like aluminum they just replace the damaged panels). So like it or not, composites, aluminum and other high tech stuff is the way of the future...
 
I work for the company that make the "pansy" aluminum for the Ford trucks. What GM doesn't say and most idiotic comments about beer can aluminum is that the aluminum is actually stronger than the steel. Yes if the thickness were the same, the steel would be stronger but the gauge of the aluminum used in the bed is much thicker than the steel in the GM bed. Tests using actual data show the aluminum to be more dent resistant than the steel. And it's still lighter. And won't rust thru. Ford didn't just wake up one day and decide to make an all aluminum body. They have been working with us since the 90's and made several all aluminum Mercury Sables for real world testing. They have been researching bonding, welding, crumple zones, etc. for years. GM and all the others for that matter are so far behind the cutting edge they will be years catching up, but yes, others are using aluminum too in more and more body panels. Most of your social media memes and "fake news" are just that. Not based on facts. Ford does use steel in the firewall, that is one area aluminum couldn't match or beat steel (fire resistance). GM is stuck in the past, they use push rod engines, yes they work and work well and they still use steel. High strength steel. Which by the way is just as expensive as aluminum and cant be repaired (like aluminum they just replace the damaged panels). So like it or not, composites, aluminum and other high tech stuff is the way of the future...

This is what's so awesome about this place. Bringing the tech.
 
I've read a lot of research on the pavers dropped from 5 feet in the air in the truck beds. I believe the pavers could pierce the aluminum bed but tests using the metal industry standard ball pressed into the metal under load the aluminum beats the steel each time. So I am sure sharp things can puncture aluminum. However, the typical loads of wood, building supplies, etc. the aluminum will be more dent resistant. And GM is spending a ton of money to follow the leader. To save face they may never make the bed floor from aluminum but they are making more aluminum intensive trucks and cars. The Cadillac CTS is one of GM's most aluminum intensive vehicles.
Anyway, our company has a huge tech center in Kennesaw GA where we are continuously working with the auto industry to improve the strength and other factors. Aluminum use is growing fast
 
plus, the IIHS crash tests showed the Ford was the best. Granted that also includes the engineering of the structure but if aluminum was so bad, it wouldn't have the ability to rank highest...
The all-aluminum Ford F-150 earned a Top Safety Pick award from the Insurance Institute for Highway Safety after receiving the best rating in a tough front crash test.
Pickup trucks from Toyota and General Motors didn't do quite so well, though, and Fiat Chrysler's Ram 1500 scored worst.
 
Is there a similar test with a steel can?
there probably is but the point is that an aluminum can that is the thickness of a human hair can hold that kind of load. No one would question the steel but everyone jokes about the F150 being made out of a beer can but again, the aluminum used in the truck is much much thicker than a beer can.
besides no one uses steel to make beer cans anymore... it's not a competitive material. Aluminum cans are coated entirely on the inside for flavor and to resist the acid is soda from attacking the aluminum. The outside has ink but the bottom is bare. Steel cans need coatings on the entire inside and out because pasteurizing the beer gets the cans wet and the steel cans rust.
 
there probably is but the point is that aluminum can that is the thickness of a human hair can hold that kind of load. No one would question the steel but everyone jokes about the F150 being made of a beer can but again, the aluminum used in the truck is much much thicker than a beer can.
besides no one uses steel to make beer cans anymore...

Don't get me wrong, I'm a big fan of using aluminum. Just curious how it actually stacks up to steel.
 
Don't get me wrong, I'm a big fan of using aluminum. Just curious how it actually stacks up to steel.
Steel is stronger, no doubt. If all things being equal. Such as the thickness. But Ford knew that. The aluminum is close but not enough. So they make it substantially thicker. Even at higher gauges the aluminum is far lighter. And best of all, aluminum does corrode but only on the surface and that oxide layer forms a protective covering. So if you scratch off the paint it will oxidize but not rust through. Even in cases like radiators where the aluminum constantly exposed to water, we have developed grain structures that resist corrosion by making the grain boundaries so difficult to move thru the area that it wouldn't leak.
One of the other cool things we did was develop an alloy that can be be strengthened by heat, The aluminum is softer when the panels are formed but when they paint he panels and cure the paint in an oven, the aluminum gets stronger. This allows for the shapes to be formed easily in stamping presses but becomes stronger after its fully formed.
 
in the 60's when the car makers made "light weight" drag cars using aluminum body panels. those panels would bend easily. We have come along way in the development of strength and formality.
 
and for those who think a beer can is made of "pansy" aluminum, read this...
http://www.abc.net.au/science/surfingscientist/pdf/teachdemo22.pdf
Almost fake fact here. The strength is due primarily to the cylindrical shape, not the material itself. The cylinder is one of the highest compression-resistant shapes out there. That is part of the experiment at the end: once loaded, one simply pokes the cylindrical wall slightly and the cylindrical shape deforms and no longer is quite as resistant to compression.

You can do the same experiment with a cardboard tube and achieve even greater weight/compresional loading.
 
Almost fake fact here. The strength is due primarily to the cylindrical shape, not the material itself. The cylinder is one of the highest compression-resistant shapes out there. That is part of the experiment at the end: once loaded, one simply pokes the cylindrical wall slightly and the cylindrical shape deforms and no longer is quite as resistant to compression.

You can do the same experiment with a cardboard tube and achieve even greater weight/compresional loading.
I get that but the fact that the aluminum is the thickness of a hair is still significant. Cardboard tubes compared to a beer can is like comparing the steel to aluminum. The cardboard tube, while weaker than aluminum, is much thicker than a can. Try stacking a bunch of books on a tube made from a sheet of paper. Paper is about the same thickness as the can. A paper tube might not hold a single book. The shape can only do so much.
Besides the axial load test, beer cans are also pressure vessels. They have to hold over 90 psi internal pressure. Again part of that is due to the cylindrical shape but again I challenge you to do that with a cardboard tube or paper tube.
Aluminum alloy used to make can bodies is 3104 and is on average .010" thick before the can is "drawn and ironed" from it. Typical yield strength of can sheet is around 38 - 40 KSI and the ultimate tensile strength minimum of 43 ksi. By comparison A36 is a common structural steel. A36 steel in plates with a thickness of less than 8 inches has a minimum yield strength of 36 ksi and ultimate tensile strength of 58 –80 ksi. So the can sheet has a higher YS but a lower UTS than structural steel. Meaning, it will withstand more load before changing from elastic deformation to plastic deformation (which means things like dent resistance), but the steel will take a higher load before it fails, such as a tear.
 
car body panels typically use 5000 series on the internal structure and 6000 series on the outside (the skin). By comparison, aerospace applications are usually 6000 series and 7000 series (structural).
  • 5000 series are alloyed with magnesium, and offer superb corrosion resistance, making them suitable for marine applications.
  • 6000 series are alloyed with magnesium and silicon. They are easy to machine, are weldable, and can be precipitation hardened
  • 7000 series are alloyed with zinc, and can be precipitation hardened to the highest strengths of any aluminium alloy (ultimate tensile strength up to 700 MPa for the 7068 alloy). 700 MPa is over 101.5 ksi.
 
I work for the company that make the "pansy" aluminum for the Ford trucks. What GM doesn't say and most idiotic comments about beer can aluminum is that the aluminum is actually stronger than the steel. Yes if the thickness were the same, the steel would be stronger but the gauge of the aluminum used in the bed is much thicker than the steel in the GM bed. Tests using actual data show the aluminum to be more dent resistant than the steel. And it's still lighter. And won't rust thru. Ford didn't just wake up one day and decide to make an all aluminum body. They have been working with us since the 90's and made several all aluminum Mercury Sables for real world testing. They have been researching bonding, welding, crumple zones, etc. for years. GM and all the others for that matter are so far behind the cutting edge they will be years catching up, but yes, others are using aluminum too in more and more body panels. Most of your social media memes and "fake news" are just that. Not based on facts. Ford does use steel in the firewall, that is one area aluminum couldn't match or beat steel (fire resistance). GM is stuck in the past, they use push rod engines, yes they work and work well and they still use steel. High strength steel. Which by the way is just as expensive as aluminum and cant be repaired (like aluminum they just replace the damaged panels). So like it or not, composites, aluminum and other high tech stuff is the way of the future...
I suspect they are using 6061T6

 
I retract my Panzy statement and have been thoroughly chastised. I'm an engineer and appreciate when the facts are presented. Ford compensated by increasing the thickness. Craig knows his stuff! I grovel at your feet :eek::rolleyes:
 
I retract my Panzy statement and have been thoroughly chastised. I'm an engineer and appreciate when the facts are presented. Ford compensated by increasing the thickness. Craig knows his stuff! I grovel at your feet :eek::rolleyes:

No need for that! It is a common misconception that aluminum is not strong. And yes I've said once and I'll say it again, all things being equal, steel is stronger.
I didn't mean to "preach". I just like to educate.
I can get a little defensive it might seem because I know that Ford stuck their neck out and took a huge risk but they did their homework.


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