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Water Wetter and distilled water

Midlife said:
You're doing yourself a dis-service by having a 160* thermostat instead of a 180 or 195*. The higher temperature thermostat will keep the water in the radiator a bit longer so air flow will be able to cool it down that much longer. With a 160*, water is continuously circulating and doesn't stay long enough in the radiator to cool down.
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I've heard this before, but I fail to see how the engine/radiator combination can recognize whether the thermostat is a 160* or a 195* once the thermostat is wide open. In hot ambient weather I am sure either thermostat is fully open and the duration of the water sitting in the radiator is wholly dependent on the water pump. My problem isn't with air flow cooling the water in the radiator, it's with the engine heating in high ambient temperatures or in traffic after being driven at speed or in a drive through or when stopped at a long traffic light. It would seem that the issue is between the radiator area and the amount of heat the engine can produce. My advanced timing and .040 overbore might have an influence on the latter, but I believe the basic problem is the inadequacy of the puny radiators that Ford put on V8 small block Mustangs.
 
redneckgearhead said:
So then why even bother with a thermostat?

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Because, in most cars with adequate radiators, the thermostat is seldom fully open and the radiator is adequate to deal with the engine's ability to produce heat. Once running at normal temp, the thermostat opens and closes to regulate the engine temperature. With a chintzy 20 1/2" two row (as built) radiator, your question about running without a thermostat is well taken.
 
Let's go back and talk about your radiator set-up. You state it is a three core but that's all I can find. The best radiators going for our cars these days are aluminum two core units. These cores are typically about an inch wide and offer far better surface area for heat dissipation than what you likely are using. Beyond that what about a fan shroud? A well designed and fit shroud will work wonders to reduce temps by controlling the airflow direction. I suggest buying a new radiator and fabbing up a shroud. I'm betting it will cure all your ills. An electric fan (controlled by a good temp sensor set-up) in place of your stock will also be a big gain for stopped or slow moving situations.
 
Horseplay said:
Let's go back and talk about your radiator set-up. You state it is a three core but that's all I can find. The best radiators going for our cars these days are aluminum two core units. These cores are typically about an inch wide and offer far better surface area for heat dissipation than what you likely are using. Beyond that what about a fan shroud? A well designed and fit shroud will work wonders to reduce temps by controlling the airflow direction. I suggest buying a new radiator and fabbing up a shroud. I'm betting it will cure all your ills. An electric fan (controlled by a good temp sensor set-up) in place of your stock will also be a big gain for stopped or slow moving situations.
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I have said it before, and will say it again...Engineered Cooling Products makes a direct fit, two row aluminum radiator for our cars. The price is spot on as well. The one in the 65 cools the 400 Hp 302 in 105 degree heat at parade speeds like a champ. That and an electric fan and we have no cooling worries. Paint it black if you want to keep a stock look.
 
I forgot to mention that one of the first things I did to deal with the car's overheating was to install a fan shroud around 1999. Since then I've run both the stock four blade fan and a Flex-A-Lite five bladed unit. The engine rebuilder who did my short block told me to lose the Flex-A-Lite because it would jeopardize my warranty on his short block. When I installed a Ford five bladed fan last summer, to replace the four bladed stocker, I also replaced the fan spacer to move the fan half way into the shroud and about 1 1/2" from the radiator. As of last summer the radiator was flow checked and the shop owner told me he'd be stealing my money if he rodded it out since it was one of the cleanest radiators he'd ever seen. I guess I could go to an aluminum radiator, but the shape of the top tank on an aluminum radiator, whether it's painted black or not, detracts from the stock look of the engine compartment. Also, won't painting it black detract from its ability to dissipate heat?
 
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KBMWRS said:
Use some coolant AND Water Wetter.
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Water Wetter actually recommends 15% antifreeze. I use water and Water Wetter with a little antifreeze in my 67 year round for many years. I do flush it every year. I don't drive the car in below freezing weather but it does sit in an unheated garage and I have never had a problem. It does run cooler than it did with 50/50. I have also added a shroud and a mechanical fan. My car doesn't over heat but it does run hotter in traffic or sitting still. I currently have underdrive pulley which I will be switching too. An article I read in Hot Rod says the water pump should spin faster than the crank or at least one to one.
 
RagTop said:
I forgot to mention that one of the first things I did to deal with the car's overheating was to install a fan shroud around 1999. Since then I've run both the stock four blade fan and a Flex-A-Lite five bladed unit. The engine rebuilder who did my short block told me to lose the Flex-A-Lite because it would jeopardize my warranty on his short block. When I installed a Ford five bladed fan last summer, to replace the four bladed stocker, I also replaced the fan spacer to move the fan half way into the shroud and about 1 1/2" from the radiator. As of last summer the radiator was flow checked and the shop owner told me he'd be stealing my money if he rodded it out since it was one of the cleanest radiators he'd ever seen. I guess I could go to an aluminum radiator, but the shape of the top tank on an aluminum radiator, whether it's painted black or not, detracts from the stock look of the engine compartment. Also, won't painting it black detract from its ability to dissipate heat?
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Get the ECP aluminum radiator. It will make a huge difference in cooling capability over the unit you have now. Find them on the Web (E-bay) and read about how a quality 2 row like theirs blows away what you have now. It's not hype. It's true.
As far as painting it, you can get paint specifically for radiators that isn't as thick as normal spray paint. I just painted the front that shows, others have painted the whole thing with now heat issues.
 
I never have had any overheating problems with the 2 row alum rad. Street or the track! Screw originality, that's for trailer queens.


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I'll chip in - I have an engine that is very similar to yours, I think. 289 bored 0.040" over, cam is 238 duration with .500 lift, HiPo distributor, stock ported heads, 9.5:1 compression, Tri-Y headers. My engine has always run cool as a cucumber, even with the stock brass 3-row radiator. I do use a shroud and a Ford stock 7-blade fan with a fan clutch though. My greatest test of it was in 116*F weather in Phoenix, where I sat in stop and go traffic with the A/C on for an hour and a half. It got itself up to 205*F.

I've found that my cam really likes a lot of initial advance. At one point it was set at somewhere around 20* initial (distributor was more or less broken and more or less locked out, so I just set it somewhere... wherever...) and it was very happy there.

I recently had my distributor rebuilt so it actually works now, and run it at 14* initial and 40* total. I put in a 2-row Northern aluminum radiator after killing the brass one in a different car - I've heard bad things about the quality of the new brass radiators. Even with the "upgraded" radiator, the car now runs a little warm at idle and a little warm at high RPMs. I was recently in Reno for Hot August Nights and on a cruise night the temp got up to 210*F sitting in traffic (low 90's weather).

The point of all this exposition is to say that maybe you might want to take another look at your timing. If it's dialed in and making peak vacuum where you have it set, then I'm sure it's fine. But if it wants more, find a way to give it more and that might help you out some. I am going to be trying that with mine soon - need to find something to pad up the advance mechanism so it doesn't advance so much. Just another thing to maybe look into if it's still giving you trouble.
 
My troubles with overheating at low speed low range 4wd work in hot weather in my 4.0 V6 Toyota Hilux were only resolved by adding a thermo fan in front of the radiator. I did the same as you, cleaned the radiator, replaced the thermostat, changed coolant, checked, checked ,checked. In the end it just needed help pushing air through the radiator when stationary or going slow if temps were over 35C.
 
Midlife said:
You're doing yourself a dis-service by having a 160* thermostat instead of a 180 or 195*. The higher temperature thermostat will keep the water in the radiator a bit longer so air flow will be able to cool it down that much longer. With a 160*, water is continuously circulating and doesn't stay long enough in the radiator to cool down.
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Absolutely correct
 
Off topic a little....this thread just reminded me I need to get a couple bottles before I can fire up the new engine!!
 
msell66 said:
Off topic a little....this thread just reminded me I need to get a couple bottles before I can fire up the new engine!!
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Didn't your Doctor tell you not to drink alcohol?

Oh...I get it! You're getting a couple of bottles for AZPete and I! Thank you very much! I'll PM you the shipping address.
 
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