Rear 3-pt Seatbelts

[AtlantaSteve]

Everyone:

Gimme your best guess...Is the rear package tray installed sturdily enough to support 3 point seatbelts? I'll reinforce it with some steel, but I worry about the entire tray being ripped out of the car.

Thanks for your input.

Steve

P.S. I know that we're mostly dealing with speculation, since we don't actually crash test our cars, but still, I'm curious what everyone thinks.

 

[lethal289]

not the cardboard overlay that came with my car, but if you used the steel underneath and reinforced it somehow i would think its better than nothing.

 

[AzPete]

Re-enforce from the mount point to the trunk floor with a full length brace. I doubt the plate it self would stay in the car to good.

 

[AtlantaSteve]

not the cardboard overlay that came with my car, but if you used the steel underneath and reinforced it somehow i would think its better than nothing.

Yeah I wasn't completely clear...I mean the metal tray under the overlay Thanks for clarifying!

 

[monkeystash]

How about just attaching it to the C pillar?

 

[AtlantaSteve]

Well I went outside and banged around on the c-pilar...I really think that might work.I could mount the retractor in the trunk, like our own Dne' did, and then mount the shoulder mount in the CPillar, and use the stock seatbelt bolt holes for the lower mount and the buckle mount.

Just need to get my seats in, and get some string, have my daughter sit in there for a little while and make sure everything lines up right..

I've seen people mount them in the package tray, but I don't think I'd ever feel really great about that.

Thanks Ryan.

Steve

 

[RustyRed]

The retractors for my rear belts are in the trunk then the belt comes through the overlay on the package tray.

We welded in some extra steel to reinforce where we mounted the retractors. The directions for the belts said to bolt them on top of the package tray. I had them there for a short while and they looked beyond terrible so we moved them into the trunk to hide them.

Attached is an older photo of the belts in back where they come through the package tray.

 

[Dne']

Trying to reason this

I've been thinking more about this. First off, I have to bring up my '57 chevy which has no seat belts(I do plan to install them soon), but when I'm driving, as I let no one else drive it, I'm very observant, and have to look way ahead in case of having to stop abruptly, or slow down. The stock drum brakes are really scary, so I'm very worried about having passengers and I show no fear while driving people around for a fun nostalgic ride. However, my '57 is not a fast/quick car, but in hopefully the near future, my stang will be on the road. I'm expecting it to be a little peppier/sassier and the stang doesn't have the meat/metal that the chevy has. However, bodies would go flying if I were to smash into something God forbid! I'm the pilot and responsible for my passengers as with anyone that is the pilot of their vehicle new or classic. So, whatever you design to restrain your loved ones, surely you would be driving with the utmost carefullness(for lack of better words!)lol WE have no air bags, no inner door structural material, I think we would be driving using our skills that have become sharpened with age and miles and "close calls"(close calls I believe are signals to wake us up to let us know we're becoming to comfortable and not paying attention).
When I had the motor,tranny out of my stang, I don't think it weighs very much~ I could push it in and out of my garage with ease! So there isn't much to the cute little body~!!

All n all~ We must do what we can to protect our passengers, and drive as if others are out to crash into you, or you them, but without being paranoid and enjoying the ride!
dne'

 

[AtlantaSteve]

Dne', this is totally off topic, but have you figured out your disc brakes yet? I see a kit everytime I flip through Speedway motors catalog, and think about your '57. The kit is quite a bit cheaper than we are used to for the mustangs, As I remember.

As for seat belts vs. driving style, I understand your point. The problem is that we have to admit that we are taking a greater risk every time we put ourselves (and our loved ones) on the street in these cars. While I like to think of myself as a good driver, I also know I am not invulnerable, and make my fair share of mistakes. I do not labor under the mistaken idea that seat belts will make it all better. These cars are inherently less safe than any modern car, and strapping yourself in well doesn't fix that...BUT I don't want to put my kids in lap belts only, and I darn sure don't want them going un-strapped...

So for me, regardless, all four seats will at least have 3 points.

 

[Dne']

just a little more talk

Hey Steve! it's your thread, you can get a little off topic I would think! lol
As for my '57, I bought the power front disc brake conversion a few months ago, just haven't gotten around to the install. you know how it is! I don't know what I paid for it, it was "reasonably priced" hah!.

As for my seat belt stuff, I still need to go back in and figure out how I'm going to make the hooks/loops for my child seat. Even in modern cars, the hooks are there to fasten the child seat in and it's still a PITA to put the seat in! So, in this case, one doesn't really use the 3 point seat belt to install a child seat, at least until the child is older and require the shoulder strap.So, I have to figure this out for my '57 and my '67 stang! Baby won't get to ride in it until these are accomplished! OMG, she'll be 3 or 4 before I've gotten around to making that happen! I'd better get on the ball! We think alike you and I, and probably everyone else here! I love it! We should have our own little town where we all live close by and have get togethers!!! ; )

Dne', this is totally off topic, but have you figured out your disc brakes yet? I see a kit everytime I flip through Speedway motors catalog, and think about your '57. The kit is quite a bit cheaper than we are used to for the mustangs, As I remember.

As for seat belts vs. driving style, I understand your point. The problem is that we have to admit that we are taking a greater risk every time we put ourselves (and our loved ones) on the street in these cars. While I like to think of myself as a good driver, I also know I am not invulnerable, and make my fair share of mistakes. I do not labor under the mistaken idea that seat belts will make it all better. These cars are inherently less safe than any modern car, and strapping yourself in well doesn't fix that...BUT I don't want to put my kids in lap belts only, and I darn sure don't want them going un-strapped...

So for me, regardless, all four seats will at least have 3 points.

 

[AtlantaSteve]

Those hooks/loops are referred to as ISOFIX or "LATCH" and are federally mandated on new cars, so you should probably be able to get the regulations about where they're allowed to be located and what gauge the rod is, etc, and figure out the best way to attach them.

I'll let you in on my plan there, though...I actually plan, while my son is in a car seat, to just use the 2pt lap belt. Of my 4 cars, only 1 is new enough to have the LATCH. My daily driver, a 99 Camry has 3 pts in the rear, and I have to use this annoying seatbelt "clamp" to basically turn them into a non-retracting 2 pt. Every car seat we've owned had "How to install in an older car." It's easier to do it with a 2 pt adjustable than a 3 pt retractable.

The reality is that you have to get it TIGHT AS H-E-1-1, because there is no attachment point at the top of the seat.

So instead of installing Latch in my car, I"m just gonna use the stock 66 rear belts for his seat...I know I can get it REALLY darn tight, and the seat will be in fairly well.

That said, obviously a LATCH system would be better and maybe safer...but I don't trust my ability to install the loops any more securely than the stock seat belts are by stock. HMM. I wonder if you could use the snap hook style eye bolts, threaded into the stock locations, and use those? http://www.summitracing.com/parts/GFR-109L/ Something like that? Maybe not.

As far as your "Even with the hooks child seats are hard to install" let me do a little advocating here...When our son was somewhere between 12 and 18 months, my wife and I were at Target, and they were selling Britax brand child seats for like 220 bucks. She said we HAD to get one, and they are normally way over 300 bucks. I scoffed at the price and said there was no way I was spending that much money on a car seat. I think any married guy can see where that went...So we go home with the car seat, and I start installing it...

It was SUCH a good design. MUCH better than the other seats we had. The installation was a snap, and the way it was designed left me feeling better about it...lots of steel parts instead of plastic.

Instead of hooks with snap-back metal tabs on it, it has a buckle type bracket with a release button. Instead of one long belt that goes from one side of the seat, through the seat body, to the other side of the seat, each side has it's own dedicated adjustable belt, and the adjustment is as easy as yanking on the belt. So to install it you loosen the belts, snap each belt directly onto the LATCH points (which is way easier than using a hook, because you can push the Britax buckle end right down onto the loop, instead of having to hook behind it) and then you push your knee down into the seat, yank on the two belt ends, and that sucker is in there tighter than a drum. It takes 3-5 minutes to install one instead of 10-15 it would take me to install his old car seat, and feel GOOD about how it was installed.

I HATE when you spend a lot of money on a product and the result is really no better than a cheaper one...but in this case I feel every penny was well spent.

 

[apollard]

Those hooks/loops are referred to as ISOFIX or "LATCH" and are federally mandated on new cars, so you should probably be able to get the regulations about where they're allowed to be located and what gauge the rod is, etc, and figure out the best way to attach them.

This give me an idea - wonder if you could get these off a newer car at the local recycler. Reinforce the mounting points, and you're good to go. LATCH is supposed to be safer than the older seatbelt mounts. But, it would be more work, since you'll eventually need the 3pt belt also.

At the rate I'm going, he'll be out of the LATCH seats anyway.

When our son was somewhere between 12 and 18 months, my wife and I were at Target, and they were selling Britax brand child seats for like 220 bucks. She said we HAD to get one, and they are normally way over 300 bucks.

She was right - a Britax for 220 is good. When we were buying stuff before Andrew was born, I balked at the 300 car seats and 150 strollers. Now, I gladly pay it - how much is the kids safety & comfort worth? Now, the number of clothes the kid "needs" is another matter...