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Chasers 66 408 Restomod / ProTouring Coupe

Discussion in 'Member's Build Threads' started by chaser012001, May 4, 2017.

  1. chaser012001

    chaser012001 66 408w, TKO600 coupe...in progress

    Thanks guys! I'm getting pretty close to starting wiring which is the hurdle i've been putting off. I dont much like working with electrical.

    I plan to follow the same plan that @Boom did (cause it was a great idea) and use painless braid under the drivers inner fender to run the wires up to the front and get a bunch of assorted braided loom to keep things tidy under the dash.
     
    Boom likes this.
  2. chaser012001

    chaser012001 66 408w, TKO600 coupe...in progress

    I fought with the front and rear windows for awhile this weekend. The gaskets went on fine but the rear window gasket is being a jerk and not wanting to flip over the edge (using the string trick). I was getting pretty pissed at it so I stopped before i did something stupid. Regroup and try again later.

    I spent a lot of time this weekend researching fuel injection systems. The base plan was to run a Holley Sniper on the RPM Air Gap. However, the more research I do the more i want to try and run a multi-port fuel injection system. However, I can only find Victor series intakes that will accept injectors. Since this is a street engine, will never see a strip, and is more likely to see autocross / road couse, I really want to use the Air Gap or equivalent but cant find any intakes that accommodate injectors. Holley has a hi ram fuel injection intake but 0 details around it other than it uses an LS throttle body...which would probably get in the way of the monte carlo support.

    I have sent an email to Edelbrock to see if, maybe, there's an RPM Air Gap for a 351w for mp fuel injection that I cant seem to find. Not holding my breath though and may just have to stick with the Sniper / Domintor EFI. First world problems...
     
  3. Horseplay

    Horseplay I Don't Care. Do you?

    Looking at my AirGap I see bosses cast in the runners into which I think you could drill and tap for injectors.
    IMG_2242.jpg
     
  4. Boom

    Boom Active Member

    I was in the same boat as you. I figured if I was going to go through the ass-pain of doing an EFI install I wanted to do MPFI. I have the Holley HP on a Vic Jr EFI intake. I was a bit concerned with the single plane, but everything I read says that a 351w or stroker shouldn't have an issue with torque off the line. Also, to get the Timed sequential efi, you'll need a cam and crank signal (i.e. Holley's Dual Sync Distributor)

    I agree the Holley ram intake looks sweet, but I didn't want to mess with the throttle body and air intake stuff.
     
  5. chaser012001

    chaser012001 66 408w, TKO600 coupe...in progress

    I've been truant and i feel ashamed...anyway.
    The ports on the air gap dont look to be big enough to be used for fuel injection. I believe they are for NOS and while i pondered with giving this thing a 50 shot, i'd likely be doing it via throttle plate vs direct into the manifold. Probably wouldnt do it anyway but meh.

    I'm going to table the EFI decision for the time being. I think i'm going to stick with the Sniper as that was the original plan. I dont like deviating much when i start on an effort. I also want to see how the car behaves with how i wanted to build it. If it has too much torque (har har har) I'll swap the manifold out and, at that point, start looking at multi-port injection. Yes i know i'll have to do some rewiring and probably some fuel line routing changes but that will just give me a reason to tinker on it more later. I also dont consider it a waste of money if I change later since I'd put the sniper in the convertible.

    In the meantime, i've been working on "piddly" things like installing weatherstrip, vent windows, door handles, etc. BTW, these new doors kinda suck. On the passenger door, the vent window mounting bolts are off by about 1/8"...just enough that I cant get the adjustment screws in the holes so that's annoying. On the drivers door, the vent window lined up perfectly but the door handle mounts dont line up. These are minor issues that I can get worked out but it was just enough to p*ss me off. Shame on me for not test fitting everything prior to paint. Lesson learned.

    Gary from vintage led's sent me a pretty nice care package consisting of parking lamps, turn signals, and backup lamps. I also discovered that, in my move, I've misplaced a box of parts containing some kind of important things like tail light buckets, headlight buckets, and stuff like that. I ended up ordering new from NPD and we're back to progress. The UPS guy has been a regular visitor over the past couple weeks.

    Last weekend I started wiring...fuse panel is mounted and i have the front lights and horn run and wired. So far the AAW kit has been solid. The horn wire was a little short for my application so i did have to splice in. Given how large the radiator is, i mounted the horns on opposite sides of the car. I'm a little concerned on length for main wires to the battery and solenoid since I plan to put both in the trunk.

    I'll take some pictures when i get a little further along in wiring. Cover up some of the ugly :-D
     
  6. chaser012001

    chaser012001 66 408w, TKO600 coupe...in progress

    Slowly making progress. Right or wrong, I decided to stick with the sniper. I'm going to start running engine wiring today or tomorrow so it's mocked in place. I think i'm going to drill a hole in the center, bottom of the firewall where the trans tunnel starts to curve. Should minimize wire visibility. The MSD 6AL will be tentatively positioned on the top / center of the trans tunnel by the firewall. It'll be hidden by the to-be-built console. If i get worried about air flow to the box I can add a computer fan but, from the research i've done, people havent seen any negative issues with this or a glove box location. I'm moderately concerned about the divider in the intake plenum not being notched like i thought it was as well as hood clearance but I'll address those issues as they come.

    [​IMG]

    I think the dash came out really good with the grafted in air vents. I used the SEM dash paint from NPD...even with sanding everything down to 600 grit it took about 14 coats to cover the way i wanted it to. Still need to run the courtesy light wires, transmission feed, and a few other misc connections. I'm also not super happy with how the underdash wires are routed. It's pretty hard visualizing where everything is going to go without actually having the components so I'm making sure i'm leaving plenty of lead to redo things if i have to. The AAW kit has been pretty solid. There has been only 3 wires that I needed to splice longer. You'll notice the dash pod is missing a gauge...thats because I dont know what I want in there yet. I'm thinking either oil temp or trans temp.
    Gauges currently installed: a/f, fuel pressure, volt, water temp, fuel, oil pressure, gps speedo, tach.

    [​IMG]

    Lastly, fuel tank and battery box are roughed in. I've also started running fuel lines. I'm going to use an Aeromotive external regulator deadheading the Sniper vs using the Snipers internal regulator. No disrespect to Holley but I trust Aero regulators...plus i can feed the gauge with the regulator.

    [​IMG]
     
    Dne' and Grabber70Mach like this.
  7. chaser012001

    chaser012001 66 408w, TKO600 coupe...in progress

    Drilled a new hole where I'd planned to and have started roughing wires through it. Sadly, I did not drill it big enough. I legit did not anticipate how many wires come off the Sniper. Once i have a final run of all the wires; i'll pull everything back through, determine what grommet will work, make hole bigger, install grommet, feed wires, drink beer.

    Another "issue" i've run into is that the Sniper's power feed wiring works under the assumption that you have your battery in the engine bay and that you're cool mounting relays and crap in there as well...which I am most certainly not. I dont want to do anything brash but I'm inclined to "extend" the wires to the connector so that I can mount the relays in the cabin. I'm still thinking on this though. For those of you about to *tisk tisk* me about wire extensions...everything electrical in this car is solder reinforced w/ appropriate or larger gauge wires as my splices which are then covered in thick heat shrink.

    Another thing...the battery relocation. Moving the battery (and starter solenoid) to the trunk made wiring the fuel tank super easy...especially with the Painless relay kit (still need an inertia switch). However, it's not without its challenges...one of which being getting alternator power back to the battery as well as running the starter feed. So here's my plan:
    * weld a post to the bottom of the rear frame rail, under the battery box, for ground.
    * drill a hole in drop leaf to feed ground cable from battery and attach to welded post. I'll need to enlarge the feed hole on the battery box as well since i'm using 1/0 cables.
    * run a 1/0 cable to the starter...not sure how i'm going to make that run yet...probably send it under the car along the inner rocker since space is getting short in the cabin wire "troughs"
    * run a 1/0 cable to the alternator following the same path of the starter. I "could" drop this to a 4 gauge cable but I'm concerned about amperage drop. I'm running a 150amp alternator and with all the electrical crap i've got going on, it's going to be working.
     
  8. Horseplay

    Horseplay I Don't Care. Do you?

    Couple thoughts come to mind seeing all the stuff you've done so far. Make sure you have good clearance between your exhaust and fuel lines. I elected to route mine out from the trunk into the recessed area of the rearend instead of out the side as you show because with the exhaust in place it was too close for safety.

    The entire car is a ground once you secure the battery negative to a solid point. I welded a stud to my roll bar in the trunk and connected the battery there. Then I created other ground points as needed in the front. As long as you have solid connections your ground runs can be short and isolated without problems.

    You don't need such a huge wire for the alternator. I have no issues at all with my set-up (everything in the trunk) even at night with lights on, etc. Power is fine and charging stays very strong. Unless you have some ridiculous power sucking stereo set-up (think window rattling, teen stuff) that #4 is more than enough.
     
    Dne' likes this.
  9. chaser012001

    chaser012001 66 408w, TKO600 coupe...in progress

    Thanks Terry. It's definitely tough getting things routed and set without everything in place. I have no issues reworking things if I have to.
    I came to the same conclusion about the alternator cable this morning after doing some more research. So i'm going to stick with the 4 gauge with a fusable link at the battery. This wire will be run mostly in the cabin along the inner rockers, passing through the toe board to the wheel side of the apron, along the frame rail, and then through the apron to the alternator. Should be pretty clean and clear of the headers going this route.

    Progress today was good but really slow. I ran the cable to the starter under the car keeping it away from where i can visualize the exhaust. I also ran the battery ground but didnt get around to welding the stud and mounting it up. The wife isnt feeling well and the garage is under the bedroom so i was trying to keep noise down.

    I spent a good majority of time messing with the Sniper and the whole "dont want to see the wiring" battle. I ended up drilling two holes in the firewall for wires. It was too much trying to get everything shoved into one and I still need to wrap them. So i have one hole that is handling the control feeds from the Sniper, MSD wires to the coil, and gauge feeds. The other hole has the power circuits for the Sniper.
    The Sniper connectors are small pin connectors that prove to be no match for a safety pin and patience. I dismantle the power connector (taking pictures of wiring orientation), fed the wires through the hole, and put it back together. I intend to mount the relays to the underside of the cowl and go about my business. Overall...i'm pretty happy with how it looks.
    To get the pins out, i pulled back the gray lock on the backside of the connector. Holley doesnt give you a whole lot of room to work with but its enough:
    [​IMG]
    Slide a safety pin in the front, top of each pin. Then pull the wires out. My focus was messed up but this is what it looks like free and clear:
    [​IMG]
    Run wires through firewall and reassemble! Power feed is the one in the top of the picture.
    [​IMG]

    Next up is getting everything connected and soldered in place which i might still do tonight.
     
    Grabber70Mach and Dne' like this.
  10. chaser012001

    chaser012001 66 408w, TKO600 coupe...in progress

    First version of wiring is pretty well wrapped up. I say "first version" because, now that I know what needs straight battery power, i'm going to add a 12v battery junction by the firewall to tidy it up. I'm also going to go crazy with zip ties to clean up under the dash. I know i'm not going to see this rats nest very often but, with all the time i'm spending with my head shoved under the dash, i want it to look...well...nicer.

    I have a few things to sort out still...like why the marker and gauge lights dont work. Should be something pretty simple so i'm not super concerned. My old ignition lock cylinder is also not cooperating. It was being stupid before i took the car apart so I think it's time for a new one.

    Good news though...turning the switch with a screwdriver and powering things up works! The Sniper powered on and recognized its sensors. The 6AL seems to be working best i can tell. The gauges also do a base sweep so I know they're hot. Another cool thing...voltage gauge is reading battery voltage :-D

    Anywho, hoping to get all that mess sorted out this week.
     
  11. Horseplay

    Horseplay I Don't Care. Do you?

    Easy on the zip ties. Route all your wiring through wire sleeving. Use the zip ties to secure the sleeving on the ends and to perhaps secure it points under the dash. In time you will need to diagnose electrical problems and this way you can do so with everything remaining intact. I've seen guys use zip ties every couple inches on harnesses and it can be an issue to trace and identify wires. It looks and stays cleaner this way too.

    The 12v battery power post is a good idea. I did the same. Just make sure it is a quality piece meant to handle high amperage.
     
  12. chaser012001

    chaser012001 66 408w, TKO600 coupe...in progress

    Agreed on the ties. I just need to get things better grouped together at the fuse box and I think i'll be happy. I have most everything run inside the techflex. I havent tied them up yet. I want to make sure i'm content with routings and grouping before doing so.

    I ordered a couple of Painless posts from Summit (along with a bunch of other stuff to keep progress moving forward). Should be more than adequate. Probably run a 4 gauge (or 8) hi-amp wire to the junction. I'm really excited to be done with the bulk of the wiring! That was a major hurdle to get over and was probably the thing i was looking forward to the least.

    So a couple things that are haunting me this morning. I'm waiting for my registration to the Holley forums to be accepted cause i want to ask a couple questions.
    1) I want to know if they sell the connectors for the Sniper touchscreen so i can break the cable, put in a male/female set, and make it so i can remove the touchscreen without having to drag the f-ing thing through the firewall. I could run the wire from the Sniper into the cabin but then, if i need to remove the Sniper, i have to pull the wire back through. I mean...i like the touchscreen but it doesnt fit with what i have in mind for the overall interior but I want the option to plug it in for tuning / data logging.
    2) I'm using their blue fuel pump wire as the relay trigger on a switch. This is working well but when i turn the power on, the fuel pump primes (in accordance with the Holley documentation for this wire) and then shuts off. I'm wanting clarification on if this wire will send a constant signal when the car starts / cranks. If it doesnt, i'll stop using the wire and go into the run circuit as my trigger.

    Anyway, i'm planning my December project list as well. Going to try and complete:
    * Wiring wrap up (pun intended)
    * electric fan install / cooling completion
    * fuel system completion (including pedal / cable)
    * seats (going with procar rally...dont judge me i think they look nice)
    * trunk / sub box
    * console
    Lets see how far i get...
     
  13. chaser012001

    chaser012001 66 408w, TKO600 coupe...in progress

    Fixed the dash lights. Helps if you have the headlight rheostat turned...told you all it'd be something simple.

    [​IMG]

    Still no front marker lights. I have 12v and a good ground so it must be something with the lights themselves. Had to call it early tonight but when I get a chance, i'm going to take out the LEDs and put in an incandescent bulbs to test.
     
    Grabber70Mach likes this.
  14. chaser012001

    chaser012001 66 408w, TKO600 coupe...in progress

    Only had a few hours in the garage yesterday but it was enough to get the electric fans "in" and wired. The fans are offset in the shroud so I'm a bit limited in the top bracket mounting. I opted to do a single center bracket up top and two "Z" brackets on the bottom. I figured this was going to be an iterative process so I made these out of 22ga steel. I'll be redoing whatever my final installation is in probably 18ga for at least the bottom and preferably in aluminum. I'm content with the bottom brackets design but the top one doesnt sit right with me. With the offset in the fans, I cant really put a bracket on the drivers side and if it's offset it's going to really bug me. So i'm pretty well stuck with a center only bracket. I do think i'm going to make it about 6" longer (3 on each side) and add more mounting holes. I'm also thinking of making some brackets for the side hangers on the fans.
    But, it's in there for now and I can progress.
    I had to pull the "orange" electric fan wire thats part of the AAW kit back out of the front feed. I originally thought I'd mount the relays in the apron on the passenger side but changed my mine and ended up putting them in the cabin up next to the cowl just right of the glove box.
    I wired a single relay to each fan so I can control them independently. I wired the Sniper electric fan outs (there are 2 of them) to the trigger wires on the individual relays. Since I'm not very trustful, I also wired a switch to relay 1 that I can force the fan on. This is connected to the orange electric feed wire from the AAW kit. Slight problem...the orange wire doesnt have 12v for some reason so I'm going to have to troubleshoot that down some more. I'm probably missing 1 of the 16000 grounds that are in this kit...

    I'm using the Dorman "Contour" fans that I picked up from Summit for $120. The angle is strange but the bracket is center to the radiator. I also want to cut off that little bracket deal thats on the top of the fan shroud.
    [​IMG]

    I also finished changing out the 12v feeds. I've gone from 4 to the cabin...to 1 at a junction. I'm MUCH happier with this.

    I like having lists, especially when i have a ton of stuff to do. So yesterday morning, while I was having my morning coffee, I made a list of all the crap I have yet to do. I have it hanging on a wall in the garage and figured I'd share it with you guys. This isnt an end all list and there is a backside to the paper, but it will help me track my progress and keep an eye on when I need to order things. I'll post updated pictures of my list from time to time.
    [​IMG]

    Sadly, i think i'm going to stall out soon due to needing some bigger ticket items. Im about two months ahead of where I thought I'd be during planning and there are things that will be blockers. For example, I need the rear suspension and housing to finish the exhaust to finish the fuel lines. Subsequently, I need seats and probably the Vintage Air unit before I can build the console. Anyway, I'll keep things updated here when decisions are made.
     
  15. chaser012001

    chaser012001 66 408w, TKO600 coupe...in progress

    Fixed the parking lights. Fun fact...aftermarket parking lights dont know how wire codes work. I found a FAQ page on AAW's site indicating such.
    Short of it, on the aftermarket lights, the black wire is the 12v to the parking lamp while the brown wire is the ground. A little swaperoo and I had lights. The LED lights from Vintage LEDs are amazeballs. They are incredibly bright and I love them!

    I've made some decisions on how I'm going to order things. As much as I want to order the rear end and finish the 'exciting' things (exhaust and fuel), I think I'm going to get the best "bang for the buck" getting the stuff to finish interior mods and steering.

    That said, I intend to call Vintage Air either today or tomorrow and discuss what I want for the car and maybe get an order in. I'd actually prefer to order it through Summit since it's $110 less and they have that $50 code right now...saving is saving.

    Along with that, I'm going to be putting in orders for the seats, steering column (tilt Ididit), and the exhaust up to the front of the rearend. Probably 3-4 different orders to maximize their $50 off orders of $500+. I called a couple weeks ago asking for a possible 10% code so i wouldnt have to do this and they said no...so...multiple orders it is in the next week or so.

    Exhaust:
    I think i'm going to run a 3" with an "X" pipe up to the mufflers. I might reduce it down to 2.5 over the axle on back when the time comes. I had kicked around putting dump outs in front of the mufflers for rowdiness but figured that was probably not necessary as the car is probably going to be plenty rowdy on its own.
    Regardless, I'll likely have to reduce it down to a 2.5" exhaust tip to get it out of the GT valance. Battle for another day.
     
  16. Horseplay

    Horseplay I Don't Care. Do you?

    As for your marker lights, polarity matters with LED bulbs. Could be as simple as that.

    EDIT: and then I finished reading your later posts...lol
     
    Grabber70Mach likes this.

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